Highly-acclaimed AV. Yes, but where..? [CLOSED]

[system]

I noticed some of your contribution and tests. Like the one when you were willing to test CIS on virtuallbox despite there were bugraports and a confirmation that Virtualbox was not able to support CIS at the time. I forgot to ask you if you were willing to install CIS in the virtuabox only for the sake of testing and you were willing to continue if those leaktests did work in the VM. I still wonder if you had CIS installed at the time though.

What, this here:

I wanted to test Matousec leak tests against Defense+ in a virtual machine, but they all fail! I guess the virtual machine beats D+ to it.

Anyway, has anyone tried to test Matousec tests against D+?

Best regards

Again, I apologize, if somehow, my english didn’t come out right, but I’m not a english speaker. But, what I meant, was not that CIS (Defense+) failed those tests, but that I was not able to perform such tests (Matousec tests) in VirtualBox. They wouldn’t even start. I was not relating any bugs with Defense+. At least, it was not what I meant to do, but as I already stated, I’m not a english speaker. So, again, I apologize for not writing 100% perfect english.

For sure I noticed you often clarified thay yours were constructive comments even though sometimes I felt to had to clarify some aspects (and sometimes I did not even though it would be needed)

I guess this is another of those occurrences.

Can you confirm that everibody should read this and implicilty asssume that each and every review computershopper featured should be online?

If not did you considered that said request likely meant a picture of the review (or an audio capture).

Well, if they have reviews from 2006 and a lot of them, why wouldn’t they have CIS review? Accidentally deleted? Maybe so… Accidents do happen. No more space to store reviews? Maybe so… It happens.

@gibran post:78

As I previosly stated I wonder if anyone is are willing to ignore that a request for clarification for an eventual and maybe unavailable online review was transformed to imply that all rewiews should be online in order to be referenced in an announcement and, if not online, a beforehand copy of said review should be stored as ‘proof’ in case some users start posting that a review never existed.

And when did I say such thing? Again, I apologize for not being a english speaker and not writing 100% perfect english.

All I ever said in this thread was/am related to is:

1st - Leolas did have a point by mentioning he couldn’t find such reviews, as I didn’t find them either myself.

2nd - I find odd Comodo press release mentions them and no one is able to find them, or better, never even seen them, perhaps. Did anyone ever came across with such reviews? I’m sure that new people, and I bet a lot, first would want to search for some reviews. Did they ever come across such? I sure didn’t.

(Personally, a few time after CIS came out (final version), I googled for CIS related reviews and I found the typical ones from Softpedia, Download.com, for example. I never came accross Computer Shopper or Computer America. Did anyone ever come across such reviews when googling for CIS related reviews?)

3rd - Then, when I saw 3 replies from 3 mods in a row… I was like… Defensive position? And I expressed what I thought.

4th - You started, perhaps, a personall agenda against me, by implying that I was trying to damage Comodo’s image and that you’re surprised that a user, like me, who gives suggestions to improve Comodo’s products, to want to be clarified about the situation in matter. Fine… It is your right… Nothing of what I will “say” will change that.

5th - Melih asked me if I was a supporter of people who hate other cultures. I told him I got disappointed by such question and later told him what I think of such. He got clarified on that. Not that I had to say anything at all, but I do like to clarify things when I am asked for something that people wish to know and that I can answer. (Being so, I also like to be clarified about something that I don’t understand, such as those reviews. Is it a matter that is off limits to be clarified?)

6th - More of the same mentioned in 4th, but also poiting other posts in other threads, saying I implied things that I clearly did not imply. And if it seemed I did, again, I apologize for not being a english speaker and for not writing a 100% perfect english.

Question:

Do you think that is by you doing what you are doing that most, if not all, people won’t be, at all, interest to know where such reviews are, if they do exist, if they did ever exist, considering that we’re talking about reviews that couldn’t have been done a long time ago, as we’re talking about a very recent product?

I want to believe that all users wish to be clarified on that and to know if the Marketing people could have confused those Magazines’s reviews with other Magazines’s reviews.

Best regards

P.S: I find it amazing, that from all my posts in all other threads suggesting things to improve Comodo’s products and even develop other security apps, that you went to pick something that was in no way related to CIS/CFP/any other product from Comodo/other vendor and totally trying to give to understand that I said something that I did not say. Amazing!!! If this is not a personall agenda against me… I don’t know what it is, then…

[Leolas]

@Melih post:72

LOL…
thanks Foxman…

Just people with ill intentions gets under my skin man… I just can’t help myself… I guess thats why I am good at security… I attack ill intention and protect our users from it

I mean this guy has the cheek to come here and does what he does abusing our good will of running an open and frank forum where we do not ban or delete people’s posts. We have a Tallemu Moderator who is not declaring himself as one (our mods are very careful of declaring their affiliation in other forums btw) having a go at us for marketing word that some marketing people have used. Give me a break! Anyone can find something wrong with almost any companies website as it is so easily done! Here is an example: “Scot Finnie the Editor in chief of Computerworld has voted Online Armor as the Best Firewall Software of 2008, through his personal blog site titles Scot’s Newsletter Blog” This is an exact quote from Tallemu site. I am only showing this as an example of how marketing words can easily be questioned and I don’t really care if Tallemu modify this or not. What is wrong with that statement is: Scott did NOT vote for it in his capacity as Editor in Chief of Computerworld, he did it in his personal blog as scot finnie. So they should not have put his title as Editor in Chief when they say he voted for it, thats misleading. Now, I don’t really care tbh, but this is just one point and one can go on about other vendors too.

So I am totally p** off with this guy, coming here not being totally frank with us, abusing our opennness, abusing my culture for something that you can easily point the finger on many other vendors, including the vendor he is affiliated with. Now that ticks me off to no end! I am pretty straight forward guy, I call it as I see it.

Melih

Melih, I should be ■■■■■■ of. In your first post here, you attacked me, instead of saying that you’ll ask your marketing people.

Then, Scott Finnie awarded OA the best firewall of 2008 in his blog, and that’s true.

But the difference is that when that happened, you and Alief started saying everywhere that tallemu paid Scott, and you two flamed a lot.

I was not flaming here, before you came flaming.

You don’t read my posts, and say that I’m accusing people, I’m attacking your culture (but that’s not true! If you really read my posts, you would know it!) paid by tallemu and so on. People here trust you, and believe in you.
So it turned out that I’m the bad boy.

Anyway, can we stay in topic, instead of accusing each other?

[Melih]

@Leolas post:82

Melih, I should be ■■■■■■ of. In your first post here, you attacked me, instead of saying that you’ll ask your marketing people.

Then, Scott Finnie awarded OA the best firewall of 2008 in his blog, and that’s true.

But the difference is that when that happened, you and Alief started saying everywhere that tallemu paid Scott, and you two flamed a lot.

I was not flaming here, before you came flaming.

You don’t read my posts, and say that I’m accusing people, paid by tallemu and so on. People here trust you, and believe in you.
So it turned out that I’m the bad boy.

Anyway, can we stay in topic, instead of accusing each other?

1. so, is what Tallemu have on their website misleading claming that “scott finiie, the editor in chief of computerworld has voted”?

2. why did you not declare your affiliation to tallemu?

thanks
Melih

[Leolas]

@Melih post:83

1. so, is what Tallemu have on their website misleading claming that “scott finiie, the editor in chief of computerworld has voted”?

In this you’re quite right :-\

It’s written and there’s also an image of the blog, but it’s written with smaller characters

http://img19.picoodle.com/img/img19/3/11/24/t_scotm_18e2b3b.png

Anyway, when I started this thread, I didn’t want to accuse Comodo, but my english is not perfect and it could be misunderstood :-X

I’m sorry that this caused a flame…

@Melih post:83

2. why did you not declare your affiliation to tallemu?

thanks
Melih

I’m not affiliated to tallemu, they don’t pay me

[Melih]

Leolas

Thank you for admitting that questionable marketing wording on tallemu site (again I have only done this to show Leolas how easy it is to pick on marketing people for their choice of words and I really do not care what tallemu does/says etc. ).

here is the definition of the word affliated. You don’t have to be paid to be affiliated.

You being a moderator in the tallemu forums puts you in the “affiliated” area.

Melih

[Leolas]

@Melih post:85

Leolas

Thank you for admitting that questionable marketing wording on tallemu site (again I have only done this to show Leolas how easy it is to pick on marketing people for their choice of words and I really do not care what tallemu does/says etc. ).

here is the definition of the word affliated. You don’t have to be paid to be affiliated.

You being a moderator in the tallemu forums puts you in the “affiliated” area.

Melih

A-ha thanks. I didn’t know that meaning of affiliated. BTW, I have no real interest in how things go for tallemu. I mean, I like OA, but that doesn’t mean that I’m a superfanatic of their company.

Then, I’m fine now… I think I won’t post in this thread anymore
I know that the answer to my question would be “yes, we wrote something false, but that’s what everybody does”

I’ve realized that everybody’s marketing people isn’t fair… This isn’t a reason to say false things or to hide things, imho (that refers to comodo, but also to tallemu, MS, apple and so on), but that’s how world goes… That’s a critic to Tall Emu too Don’t take it for an accuse to Comodo, 'cause I know that also Tallemu, Symantec, Kaspersky, MS, Apple, Mozilla, Google, Linuxers and so on behave in the same way :-\

Leo

[gibran]

@DarkButterfly post:81

What, this here:

Again, I apologize, if somehow, my english didn’t come out right, but I’m not a english speaker. But, what I meant, was not that CIS (Defense+) failed those tests, but that I was not able to perform such tests (Matousec tests) in VirtualBox. They wouldn’t even start. I was not relating any bugs with Defense+. At least, it was not what I meant to do, but as I already stated, I’m not a english speaker. So, again, I apologize for not writing 100% perfect english.

@DarkButterfly post:5

@gibran post:4

Virtualbox has often been reported to be unable to support CFP/CIS :THNK

Yes, for a very long time now.

…snip…

So you did know that that virtualbox was reported to be unable to support CIS but you wanted to test those leaktests in Virtualbox. ???

@DarkButterfly post:1

I wanted to test Matousec leak tests against Defense+ in a virtual machine
…snip…

Did you have CIS installed outside the virtualbox at the time? ???

@DarkButterfly post:1

Anyway, has anyone tried to test Matousec tests against D+?

Why you were willing to test those leaktest on the VM but not on a normal setup? ???

@DarkButterfly post:19

Again, I do not consider Comodo products bad, or in this case, the AV. I am not bashing Comodo in no way. I use Comodo firewall and not because it is free, but rather because it offers a great protection. So, how could I be bashing a product I just love?

I’m sorry If I had assumed you didn’t have CIS Installed and I’m sorry if I have to ask about that VM topic but I would really appreciate a clarification about this as I have no direct way to confirm it and I will take your words for this.

@DarkButterfly post:81

Well, if they have reviews from 2006 and a lot of them, why wouldn’t they have CIS review? Accidentally deleted? Maybe so… Accidents do happen. No more space to store reviews? Maybe so… It happens.

Very evocative, you don’t deny and you don’t confirm but I asked

Can you confirm that everybody should read this and implicitly assume that each and every review computershopper featured should be online?

If not did you considered that said request likely meant a picture of the review (or an audio capture in Computer America’s case)?

Was your focus on reading said reviews or only to confirm that they do exist?
I notice you evaded a related aspect again. Those interested in the whole topic won’t miss that.

@DarkButterfly post:81

And when did I say such thing? Again, I apologize for not being a english speaker and not writing 100% perfect english.

I’m not a native english speaker either and I know for sure that I’m not versed in writing english posts.
I wonder if my initial post were not clear enough and this long exchange of reply in only caused by a misunderstanding.

@DarkButterfly post:81

P.S: I find it amazing, that from all my posts in all other threads suggesting things to improve Comodo’s products and even develop other security apps, that you went to pick something that was in no way related to CIS/CFP/any other product from Comodo/other vendor and totally trying to give to understand that I said something that I did not say. Amazing!!! If this is not a personall agenda against me… I don’t know what it is, then…

But then again I invite everybody to read from this post onward.

@gibran post:29

Provided that I had no interet to find more info about these references I would like to know is anybody expected Melih to post a picture (or maybe an audio capture) of the reviews of Computer America and Computer shopper.

If even said articles were recorded in order to be presented as proof in case an user wanted to verify those info I guess the Press Contact Email (media-relations[ at ]comodo.com) would be of more use anyway I hardly believe that said scenario was ever considered to be reasonably likely to happen.

@DarkButterfly post:81

Do you think that is by you doing what you are doing that most, if not all, people won’t be, at all, interest to know where such reviews are, if they do exist, if they did ever exist, considering that we’re talking about reviews that couldn’t have been done a long time ago, as we’re talking about a very recent product?

I stated what I though as soon I joined this topic. I pointed out the email of comodo Media relation department (as only personnel of that department could likely know about that announcement).

As I did not restrict the focus only to online reviews I also asked if anybody expected Melih to post a picture (or maybe an audio capture) of the reviews of Computer America and Computer shopper.

Soon after I pointed out it would be far more easy to assume that these reviews are not available online since even when a magazine has an online site it cannot be assumed that every written article is mirrored on the online version.

It is not unikely that the online version has a subset and/or different articles from the printed version. It is oblious that there are also online sites hosting a full mirror of the printed version and sites that have no printed version at all.

I still don’t think either that any media relations departement out there is likely to save a digital copy of each review cited in the public announcements.

I’m so sorry if I wasn’t able to focus only on the legitimate aspect of your replies.You were obviously motivated to know a simple fact and possibly read an online review.

@DarkButterfly post:30

Well, if Melih has no intentions to clarify this situation, that I do find odd and weird (for all the reasons I mentioned before), then one could only consider that, either there are, in fact, no such reviews, or they do exist, but are classified as “top secret” and no one can have access to them?

@DarkButterfly post:31

Anyone here from the press? Would Comodo really answer or answer in a honest way?

What scenario didn’t Comodo “considered to be reasonably likely to happen”? The fact users would try to find such reviews and question why mentioning them if do not exist?

Besides, the best solution to clarify this is to ask Comodo’s CEO and President in person, as he also comes to the forum. Direct and clean. Period.

But from what you posted it’s clear you confirmed there is no online review.
Said review could have been printed on paper(computershopper) only or could have been broadcasted on radio (Computer America).

I thought it was reasonable to invite everybody consider this but yet

@DarkButterfly post:81

Well, if they have reviews from 2006 and a lot of them, why wouldn’t they have CIS review? Accidentally deleted? Maybe so… Accidents do happen. No more space to store reviews? Maybe so… It happens.

[Melih]

Here is the response from marketing people:

---

Comodo Internet Security was an important product launch for Comodo—virus prevention and protection are a big job. Here in the marketing department, we see CIS as being one big AntiVirus product, and we all wanted to express that vision in different ways. With document versions floating around, ideas got compressed together that shouldn’t have been.

Sean Portnoy at Computer Shopper did recommend the firewall, if you look at the list in the middle of the page

http://computershopper.com/feature/5-free-downloads-to-improve-your-computing-life-june-2008

(My records also say that in April, 2007, ComputerShopper included Comodo AntiVirus 1.1 in its “List of Favourites” for computer trials (DVD only). I can’t find that online right now, but perhaps that’s because ComputerShopper’s forums are down.)

Computer America did not recommend the firewall or antivirus, though they did interview you.

The reviews and the interview were conflated. Forum members are right to call us on them. I hope they will overlook and forgive the oversight. I appreciate their all paying so much attention to our new products, as well as what we say about them.

---

[Leolas]

@Melih post:88

Here is the response from marketing people:

---

Comodo Internet Security was an important product launch for Comodo—virus prevention and protection are a big job. Here in the marketing department, we see CIS as being one big AntiVirus product, and we all wanted to express that vision in different ways. With document versions floating around, ideas got compressed together that shouldn’t have been.

Sean Portnoy at Computer Shopper did recommend the firewall, if you look at the list in the middle of the page

http://computershopper.com/feature/5-free-downloads-to-improve-your-computing-life-june-2008

(My records also say that in April, 2007, ComputerShopper included Comodo AntiVirus 1.1 in its “List of Favourites” for computer trials (DVD only). I can’t find that online right now, but perhaps that’s because ComputerShopper’s forums are down.)

Computer America did not recommend the firewall or antivirus, though they did interview you.

The reviews and the interview were conflated. Forum members are right to call us on them. I hope they will overlook and forgive the oversight. I appreciate their all paying so much attention to our new products, as well as what we say about them.

---

The link they provided refers to CFP not to CAV, but thanks anyway
There’s something true

[JamesFrance]

So Leolas, you got what you wanted, I hope you are satisfied now.

[Leolas]

@JamesFrance post:90

So Leolas, you got what you wanted, I hope you are satisfied now.

I feel some irony in your post… :THNK

Anyway, yes, I’m half satisfied

[kail]

@Leolas post:91

Anyway, yes, I’m half satisfied

Well at least you’re not half dissatisfied then. ;D

[JamesFrance]

Oh but he is.

[Leolas]

@kail post:92

Well at least you’re not half dissatisfied then. ;D

eheh! ;D

BTW, I’m more satisfied than dissatisfied also because noone is flaming, now

@JamesFrance post:93

Oh but he is.

Sorry?
If you have to say something against me, say it. In you previous post, I thought that you were making some fun…

[thebazman]

hi

@JamesFrance

This thread took a turn for the worse earlier with alot of things said taken the wrong way.
your comments to me are inciting it to happen again.

cheers

[kail]

@Leolas post:94

eheh! ;D

BTW, I’m more satisfied than dissatisfied also because noone is flaming, now

Oh… so, you lied then? ;D

@Leolas post:94

Sorry?
If you have to say something against me, say it. In you previous post, I thought that you were making some fun…

It’s OK, I’m sure James doesn’t mean anything by it. I think James didn’t spot my humor (easy to miss) & was just pointing out (to me) that you were only half satisfied & thus, half dissatisfied.

[JamesFrance]

Yes of course, by definition if you are half satisfied you must be half dissatisfied.

Obvious really.

(:LGH)

[Leolas]

@kail post:96

Oh… so, you lied then? ;D
It’s OK, I’m sure James doesn’t mean anything by it. I think James didn’t spot my humor (easy to miss) & was just pointing out (to me) that you were only half satisfied & thus, half dissatisfied.

@JamesFrance post:97

Yes of course, by definition if you are half satisfied you must be half dissatisfied.

Obvious really.

(:LGH)

:THNK :THNK :THNK :THNK :THNK :THNK :THNK

;D

[Coolio10]

Leolas just be happy Melih lets his forum be so open and not delete people’s posts like the tallemu forum. Me and a comodo forum member mentioned that Scott Finnie reccommended OA ,until a release of OA came out that was buggy and broken. Scott changed his blog to the version number that was actually good instead of reccommending comodo instead. Now that is real false advertising - changing the source information so it can still be used. Our posts got deleted almost instantly after mentioning that on the tallemu forums.

[Leolas]

@Coolio10 post:99

Leolas just be happy Melih lets his forum be so open and not delete people’s posts like the tallemu forum. Me and a comodo forum member mentioned that Scott Finnie reccommended OA ,until a release of OA came out that was buggy and broken. Scott changed his blog to the version number that was actually good instead of reccommending comodo instead. Now that is real false advertising - changing the source information so it can still be used. Our posts got deleted almost instantly after mentioning that on the tallemu forums.

[cut by leolas: sorry, I promised yesterday that I’m not going to answer to accuses. I did it, but I decided to delete the post…]