So where are the CIS users with viruses.

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Sounds good Melih :slight_smile:

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—> (:LOV) <—

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I agree with the statement that CIS is working. It does a wonderfull job and is not “in your face” like some other Firewall/Av solutions. Why would someone complain if it does the job it is made to do? Maybe their are other motives for this complaints…

Hope that Comodo does not get put off by this sort of things and keep on the good job they are doing.

**** My 5 cents ****

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All your points of view are valid. I accept that. As I mentioned, all I said is based on things I see on a daily basis. But, are your points of view based on your own experience of dealing with every system alert, because you already known what is what? Or because you know hundreds of people who say: Hey, I got Defense+ in Safe Mode and I know how to answer to every and each alert that D+ pops up, specially those red alerts, all mixed up. It’s a treat mates?

Quote from Melih

How do you know your uninstallation rate is less than 5%? Because when people uninstall CFP/CIS a Internet Explorer pops up to take them to the “why uninstalling” page? I uninstall CFP and now CIS (firewall and defense+) everytime a new version comes out and I never allow such attempt to connect to the IE, even less the Internet, as I don’t even uninstall a security app with Internet on. Are those uninstallations included in the less than 5%?

What makes you think that everyone who installs and then uninstalls (either to make a clean install of a new version or simply just because no longer wants to use it) will allow such attempt to open IE, or that they even uninstall CFP/CIS with their Internet connection on?

Quote from Kyle

That’s what I said. We could all set all other daily apps as Trusted Applications, but the question remains: Do these apps need all those priveligies?

I guess that then the password for settings protection should have other name that Parental Control, such as Settings Protection.

I never mentioned that D+ should be replaced. All I ever said is that for some people D+ just isn’t their choice as they won’t know to answer to all those alerts.
D+ is powerful, YES! I never said the opposite. All I said is that such power is not meant for the average user. For such user, why not a “smarter” D+, which could only alert the user in case something really bad could be happening? Isn’t this approach better than the user not knowing how to answer to an alert, that could be nothing but one of his/her daily apps wanting to update, just like their browser?

Lets be honest: The full power D+ provides comes either, in the very least, from Safe Mode, and then, even more power (as in control) in Paranoid Mode.

Training Mode and Clean PC Mode offer, in no way, such great protection. Or can you say it does? Otherwise why Safe Mode and Paranoid Mode? Such options would make no sense in such context.

I don’t want D+, as it is right now, to simply die. But why not let people choose between the “classical” HIPS and the new “smarter” HIPS (if it ever comes to exist)? Because again, in my opinion, D+ is not for everyone.

Lets face it. As you well said D+ is the heart of CFP/CIS. Without it, both CFP and CIS or CAV suck big time. If D+ is/was that easy to work with (meaning that all people know how to answer all those alerts, specially those red alerts, that sometimes come from safe applications and D+ says there are malware alike activities, which by turn users can all distinguish between those “fake” red alerts and “real” red alerts.), then would any other security company that develops behavior blockers and other smarter HIPS, such as DefenseWall exist? Or would such products have a reason to exist? No reason at all. Why? D+ offers the best protection, and it does!, and everyone knows how to work with it. Plus, it is free! Why would they simply pay for other solution when they could get a free and easy to use one? Would make no sense, at all. Or would it?

Again, this is how I see it. I believe I am entitled to my opinion, either you considerer it is right or wrong. 'Cos as far I as i see things, you’re the one who’s wrong. So, who’s right and who’s wrong? Are we both right and wrong at the same time?

Quote from ghostza

Yes, CIS is working. Did you see me say otherwise? What you mean with not “in your face”? (I’m not being sarcastic, I really don’t understand. Do you mean a pain in the neck?)

I don’t complain for the great job it does! It does a wonderful job and I will install CFP in my new system! But, I will be taking CFP off this system, because my relatives simple don’t have the time to learn how to answer all those alerts, for all the reasons I mentioned before. They work and study at the same time! Between this, where do they have time to waste to answer all those alerts? Sure, they could just treat each known application as Trusted Application, but as I already asked, is there a need for such? No, there is not. And the only way for D+ to offer the great protection we know that it offers is, either in Safe Mode or Paranoid Mode.

Does anyone here have CIS in default settings, knowing that it won’t provide strong protection? I wish a honest answer here.

Which motive would I possible have to complain? Am I complaining? I’m giving my opinion. Is an opinion a complain?

Best regards

25

LA’s 2 cents

1st cent:

I’m not saying that D+ can’t be improved, but I think your suggestion of having less alerts is already there. With CIS Comodo eased off the D+ settings a bit in Internet Security Mode (Configuration) to get less alerts, whilst the lowered level of protection is raised by the Antivirus.

2nd cent:

Suck big time? I don’t know how CFP acts without D+ so I’ll pass on that one, but as for CAV… you don’t know how many signatures it has (me neither, but I know how many they add each week!). Of course I know it’s not all about signatures but that’s one part. Soon enough we’ll see heuristics as well. So claming that CFP and CAV suck is a bit harsh to me.

LA

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DarkButterfly.

I hope the next version of CIS 3.5x which will include ThreatCast & further white listing will be a step in a right direction from your point of view. :wink: Also as LA Said Heuristics will come in next update too.

Hoping to be released by end of this year. It’s a big update.

Josh

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When I said CAV (also) sucks without D+ is that it bases it’s protection in detection and detection only (without D+). And still has no heuristics. I don’t say that CAV is bad at detecting. I believe it detects all it can detect. Couldn’t be otherwise, I guess. :smiley:

And CFP is not just a firewall. Is a firewall + HIPS. Without HIPS component (D+), do you really think that CFP would be what it is? No freaking way. I’m honest about that. I say it out loud. CFP is a great firewall + classical HIPS. Without D+, CFP wouldn’t be 10% of what it is, now would it?

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That would be a great way of making it easier for most people to use it.

(Personally, I do not care the way D+ is now. I want full control, which implies to answer to each and every alert to make the apps “work” the way I wish and not the way they wish, to some extent. But, from my point of view, I know how to answer and when I don’t know how to answer in the moment, I know where to look for info. Not everyone knows either how to answer or where to get info. Both these steps are crucial for the security D+ offers, which is a great security! That’s all I wanted to express! Also, based on what I said, at least, about my relatives, who work and study at the same time, and that just want to use the Internet for a little while (and I think there are a lot of people in this situation), they don’t wish and do not want to waste that very short time to try to find information on how to answer on each and every alert. That’s all. Never anyone has seen me mentioning that D+ was bad. I would be insane to say that, as I use it on this system (for the meantime) and will be using it on my new system, as soon as I have it. But, as I said, I know what to do, 'cos my life is computers. I can waste all my time with it. They can’t. That’s all.)

Best regards

29

Of course it wouldn’t, that’s no secret (it has been stated again and again that CFP’s leak proofness depends a lot on D+), but which firewall would? This could easily get into a discussion where you draw the line between a pure firewall and a “leak protection program”. Many people would say that CFP is much more than a pure firewall.

Let’s not go too far !ot!

LA

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Yes, indeed. lets not go on an off-topic, but that’s what I wanted to meant. CFP is great as the package, because without that full package, well, wouldn’t it be an average app? (No need to answer, is a rethorical question :slight_smile: )

Best regards

31

Let me just confirm that I’ve read this and I’m fine with it. :wink:

LA

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Well…

;D

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at DarkButterfly

your question about less than 5%.

I used the number 5 cos its something like 3.8%… and I didn’t say 4% to accomodate the some other people like you.

now, how can I confirm this number? easy…

updates! We know how many people make a call to make update to our servers.

Melih

34

That’s fair. :slight_smile: Anyway, is just a small detail in the ocean. And why wouldn’t I feel accomodated if you had said 3.8% or 4% instead of the 5% you said? Would I go mad at it, is that it?

Also, like me? Am I some specific type of person? Are there others like me?

Now, lets make an assumption: What if some “crazy” people like me, who have more than a system, uses CFP in more than a system. Would that count as 1 person or as, lets imagine, 5 people? (No need to answer. Rethorical question.)

Best regards

P.S: If you do find the need to answer, please, don’t feel like you have the need to accomodate me.

By the way, I did not ask you to confirm any numbers, still, thank you very much. Anyway, to know the exact % of people (considering 1 installation per person) who has CFP/CIS on their systems, we would need to know the exact number of people who downloaded both of those apps, from all over the internet, then the exact number of people who uninstalled it and did allow the uninstallation to connect to the internet and the exact number of people who won’t allow or won’t uninstall CFP/CIS with their Internet connection on. As you may see, there is no way to provide an exact number, not even close. Then again, i’m not exactly a math geek. But even I do have some brain to do some simple math.

The updates only tell the % of people who still have it installed and considering that each system that updates CFP/CIS are all from different people. 1 person could have 5 systems running CFP/CIS, as the example I gave above.

So, you can’t say that the 3.8% or 4% or even 5% of people who unninstall CFP/CIS are based on the updates that are made, because as I said above, you can only say that, considering the updates, the % of people using CFP/CIS is X%. :slight_smile:

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updates come from IPs… but each installation is unique due to activation logic we put in. We also know roughly the percentages of people who have more than one copy per IP etc.

it still doesn’t change the fact that we have around 15 Million users! Yep… very nice indeed :slight_smile: And yes We are the first Company who has deployed a “Layered Security” architecture where "Prevention" is the first line of defense. And you are seeing the results of with! Silence on our forums from people complaining they got malware while using CIS! Ask yourself why! Because Prevention as your first line of defense is the only answer to today’s threats! Yes it was challanging to make it work for the end users! Yes it required an amazing amount of research and development, but millions of people have proven that it works! Of course there are much work ahead of us. We want to improve user interaction of this world’s first “prevention as first line of defense” and next release will do that even further! We have solved the security problem! Our users are more secure (again look at the silence of people complaining that they are infected) and CIS was the first great step at usability and this will only get better!

Melih

36

Thats why I use CIS(without AV as I don’t need it). Have you ever seen me say that CFP/CIS are bad products? If you did, please point me out.

Thanks

P.S: Interesting sentence of yours - “We have solved the security problem!”. Considering that no security system provides 100% protection, could you truly say that? Do you (CFP) provide a strong protecion? Yes, indeed! Can you say “We have solved the security problem!”? Isn’t this saying something that isn’t accurate and totally show lack of respect to whom creates malware and performs other types of cyber attacks? (I do not love this folks, but I do respect the ways they find to infect and steal information, using methods, each time, more advanced. So, I have all respect for these guys. The day we stop having respect, well, we’re doomed.)

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Hi DarkBut,

Well you did say this didn’t you?

Lets face it. As you well said D+ is the heart of CFP/CIS. Without it, both CFP and CIS or CAV suck big time.

You can hardly be surprised when others question your motives when you include statements like that in your arguments.

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its easy enough to take anything out of context and play it back:)

security problem i am referring to is: End users paying roughly about $5 Billion to vendors whose security product do not protect them from many uknown malware. So end users were under false sense of security thinking that they are secure from uknown malware.

that is the problem we have solved. No security is 100%, however we have now provided a security product that protects the users from as many malware as all the other AV vendors can detect and plus more. That is an achievement you can’t ignore.

Melih

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Yes, indeed. You do provide great security product that protects users from free.

About the “its easy enough to take anything out of context and play it back:)”. When I read “We have solved the security problem!” in the context of your text, that’s what gave to understand; that you meant Comodo solved the security problem. Sorry, but that’s what I understood.

“That is an achievement you can’t ignore.”

Did I ever say otherwise? I never said that with CIS/CFP users would be badly protected, did I? The question was: will they know how to use such powerful tool (Defense+ - the heart of CFP and CIS)? (No need to answer as my points of view were all said about that matter.)

If you find one single post where I bashed Comodo or any Comodo product, please, let me know about it (the only thing I said and still see it that way is that without Defense+, Comodo’s firewall and av are average security apps. Can or will anyone deny this?). If I was such user, honestly tell me, would I ever suggest improvements and even PM you refering you, for example, a web site where your AV guys could keep an eye on for new malware? Maybe so. If that’s the case, I’ll stop making suggestions. 'Cos so far, it only has made me be the bad guy, it seems.

Best regards

40

Yes, I did. Won’t deny. I also said that when I said it, I meant to say that without Defense+, Comodo’s firewall and av, would be average security apps. Why? CFP wouldn’t be 10% of what it is. The AV, at the moment, still has no heuristics.

What I said without taking out any words: [b]When I said CAV (also) sucks without D+ is that it bases it’s protection in detection and detection only (without D+). And still has no heuristics. I don’t say that CAV is bad at detecting. I believe it detects all it can detect. Couldn’t be otherwise, I guess.

And CFP is not just a firewall. Is a firewall + HIPS. Without HIPS component (D+), do you really think that CFP would be what it is? No freaking way. I’m honest about that. I say it out loud. CFP is a great firewall + classical HIPS. Without D+, CFP wouldn’t be 10% of what it is, now would it?[/b]

Can anyone or will anyone deny that Defense+ is what makes CFP and CIS such a powerful security application? I want to see if anyone will… will be “funny”.

Best regards